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Timed reversing polarity circuit


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hotwaterwizard 
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Joined: December 11, 2003
Location: California, United States
Posted: March 01, 2006 at 9:21 AM / IP Logged  

That would have been nice to know when I was designing the circuit. I should have read it better.

I will see if I can come up with another.

John DeRosa (Hotwaterwizard)
Stockton California
When in doubt, try it out !
xtremespeed 
Member - Posts: 38
Member spacespace
Joined: February 10, 2006
Location: Texas, United States
Posted: March 01, 2006 at 11:53 AM / IP Logged  
Thats ok. Your help is greatly appreciated. The motor actually came with a momentary spdt switch, which works just fine. I want to use a spst switch, which is why I need a timed circuit. With the momentary spdt switch, I can just hold the switch either direction for 3 sec and accomplish what I need. The spst that I want to use is the cause of my whole problem.Timed reversing polarity circuit - Page 2 -- posted image.
KPierson 
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Joined: April 14, 2005
Location: Ohio, United States
Posted: March 01, 2006 at 7:31 PM / IP Logged  

I wrote the code tonight but I won't be able to do anything else until I fly back to Dayton, Ohio this Friday.  By Monday I should have something to send to you.

The software is pretty basic, it just monitors the switch input (switch to ground).  If it sees the switch is turned on then it turns on an 'open' output for 3 seconds.  During these three seconds it continues to montior the switch, and if the swich is shut off it will shut off the output and turn on the close output.

If the switch stays in the 'on' position for the full three seconds the 'open' output shuts off and the module waits for for the switch to be shut off.  when it is shut off it ouputs a 'close' signal for 3 seconds.

The only thing I'm not sure about is what will happen if you leave the switch in the 'on' position and shut the car car off?  Do you think that is something that needs to be addressed?  We could set it up to automatically close when the ignition is shut off.  Let me know what you think.

Kevin Pierson
xtremespeed 
Member - Posts: 38
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Joined: February 10, 2006
Location: Texas, United States
Posted: March 01, 2006 at 9:32 PM / IP Logged  

Sound good Kevin.

I dont think we need to worry about the switch being left on and the car turned off. I have a master arm switch that  controls the entire nitrous system and is connected to a constant power source, so the module wouldn't know whether the car was on or not. The master arm switch will provide power to the opener switch, so when the master arm is turned off the opener switch will go open and the module will close the bottle. If I decide that I want to be able to turn the bottle on with the master arm switch off, I can always connect the opener switch to a constant power source.

I'm not sure I know what you meant by "it just monitors the switch input (switch to ground). " You realize that the switch doesn't rest at ground correct? It only supplies 12v when on, and will be open when off.

Also, how hard would it be to change the timed portion to 5 sec? I was thinking about how hard the bottle is to open and close. If the motor took an extra second or so to get the knob moving, 3 sec might not be enough. I have opened and closed it many times with a momentary switch and I have never seen it take more than 2 sec, but since the motor has a clutch, I think a 5 sec output would offer a descent safety net.

KPierson 
Platinum - Posts: 3,527
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Joined: April 14, 2005
Location: Ohio, United States
Posted: March 03, 2006 at 4:17 PM / IP Logged  

Well I spent about 5 mintues in the airport today making the changes.  I got a little lazy with the 5 second delay and we'll have to settle for ~4.92 seconds.  I think that that will be precise enough for our application.  If things go well (which so far today they haven't) I'll have this built and tested tonight.

Kevin Pierson
KPierson 
Platinum - Posts: 3,527
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Joined: April 14, 2005
Location: Ohio, United States
Posted: March 03, 2006 at 4:19 PM / IP Logged  

I have a question for you.

If you have a 'master arm' switch why use a separate switch for the bottle opener?  You should be able to tie my module to the other switch, and whenever you flip on the 'master' arm switch the bottle will open.  Also, do you think it would be a good idea to add an LED output to indicate that the bottle is open?  It would be easy enough to do.  Let me know what you think.

Kevin Pierson
xtremespeed 
Member - Posts: 38
Member spacespace
Joined: February 10, 2006
Location: Texas, United States
Posted: March 03, 2006 at 7:47 PM / IP Logged  

Sometimes it's necessary to have the system armed, but the bottle closed. For instance, I use my purge solenoids to release the pressure from the lines after the bottle has been closed. I think the led output is a good idea. I may or may not use it. The switch for the opener is illuminated when on, so it kinda gives a visual that the bottle is open. I won't be mad if you add features though.Timed reversing polarity circuit - Page 2 -- posted image. Did you get the last pm I sent? I had a couple questions.

KPierson 
Platinum - Posts: 3,527
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Joined: April 14, 2005
Location: Ohio, United States
Posted: March 04, 2006 at 11:21 AM / IP Logged  

OK, the main circuit is built and tested.  Seems to work perfect.  I'm going to add a few more lines of code to address some minor issues that I'm seeing, mainly when you switch from 'on' to 'off' while the open output is still on.  I'm going to put a 0.25 second delay between the different outputs to help protect the bottle opener motor. 

I also programmed in the (-) open feedback output.  Basically, after the open output signal is done (~5 seconds) this output turns on and stays on until you flip the switch back off, then the output shuts off immediately.  I was thinking you can wire this ground directly to the opener switch.  This is a good idea because it is a diagnostic tool for the module.  With it set up this way you'll hit your 'master arm' switch, hit your 'bottle open' switch and then about 5 seconds later the 'bottle open' switch will light up letting you know that the module is working. 

What do you think?

Kevin Pierson
xtremespeed 
Member - Posts: 38
Member spacespace
Joined: February 10, 2006
Location: Texas, United States
Posted: March 05, 2006 at 2:04 PM / IP Logged  
I hadn't thought about having the switch light up only when the bottle is open. I really like that idea. Looks like you have everything covered nicely.
KPierson 
Platinum - Posts: 3,527
Platinum spaceThis member consistently provides reliable informationspace
Joined: April 14, 2005
Location: Ohio, United States
Posted: March 05, 2006 at 4:29 PM / IP Logged  

OK, the modules are ready to ship!

Here are a few pics:

Timed reversing polarity circuit - Page 2 -- posted image.

Timed reversing polarity circuit - Page 2 -- posted image.

The box on the right is the bottle opener module

Yellow: Ignition Power (15amp fuse provided)

Black: Ground
Purple: 12vdc switched open input (bottle open switch)
Orange (-) 100mA open feedback output (use current limiting resistor for LED, or drive lighted switch direct)

The box on the left is a relay pack, containing two SPDT relays.

Green: Bottle Open Output (10A relay)
Blue: Bottle Close Output (10A relay)

After I got it all up and working I went out and picked up a few switches with lights in them.  The (-) feedback outptu is definately cool and works perfectly.

Hows everything look?  I'll send you a PM with more information.

Thanks,

Kevin Pierson
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